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Post by cardsfan606 on Feb 27, 2024 13:15:51 GMT -6
name any other established FBS school that geographically makes sense, has FBS football, that we could get right now. Why expand at all? If you don’t understand that right now, then I can’t help you. Look at every other conference in collegiate sports at the FBS level. There have been 15 schools jump up from FCS to FBS over the past handful of years. With Delaware and Kennesaw state for sure moving up and now Tarlton State being rumored as well. With the Big 10 moving up to 18 schools, and all of these FCS schools moving up it’s inevitable. I’m more traditional, and would prefer 12 member conferences with divisions, but everything is moving away from this, and I don’t want to get left behind. Arguably we already have by the Sunbelt. I remember when the Sunbelt used to be the bottom feeder and now they’re the top group of five school in football. And your whole mentality of why even expand has us in the position we’re in now. Is UMass a great ad no. But reading through some of their stuff. It sounds like they actually have a decent head coach now, and they have money being invested into the football program. More than us. Additionally, Frank Martin is their basketball coach right now and they seem like they have a lot of potential. |
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Post by JacksonStreetElite on Feb 27, 2024 13:18:50 GMT -6
If you don’t understand that right now, then I can’t help you. Look at every other conference in collegiate sports at the FBS level. There have been 15 schools jump up from FCS to FBS over the past handful of years. With Delaware and Kennesaw state for sure moving up and now Tarlton State being rumored as well. With the Big 10 moving up to 18 schools, and all of these FCS schools moving up it’s inevitable. I’m more traditional, and would prefer 12 member conferences with divisions, but everything is moving away from this, and I don’t want to get left behind. Arguably we already have by the Sunbelt. I remember when the Sunbelt used to be the bottom feeder and now they’re the top group of five school in football. And your whole mentality of why even expand has us in the position we’re in now. Is UMass a great ad no. But reading through some of their stuff. It sounds like they actually have a decent head coach now, and they have money being invested into the football program. More than us. Additionally, Frank Martin is their basketball coach right now and they seem like they have a lot of potential. If your entire argument is "everyone else is doing it" then you're right, you can't help me. |
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Post by cardsfan606 on Feb 27, 2024 13:28:56 GMT -6
If you don’t understand that right now, then I can’t help you. Look at every other conference in collegiate sports at the FBS level. There have been 15 schools jump up from FCS to FBS over the past handful of years. With Delaware and Kennesaw state for sure moving up and now Tarlton State being rumored as well. With the Big 10 moving up to 18 schools, and all of these FCS schools moving up it’s inevitable. I’m more traditional, and would prefer 12 member conferences with divisions, but everything is moving away from this, and I don’t want to get left behind. Arguably we already have by the Sunbelt. I remember when the Sunbelt used to be the bottom feeder and now they’re the top group of five school in football. And your whole mentality of why even expand has us in the position we’re in now. Is UMass a great ad no. But reading through some of their stuff. It sounds like they actually have a decent head coach now, and they have money being invested into the football program. More than us. Additionally, Frank Martin is their basketball coach right now and they seem like they have a lot of potential. If your entire argument is "everyone else is doing it" then you're right, you can't help me. if that’s all you took away from it, then yeah, I definitely can’t help you. A little bit more critical thinking on your end might help. We’ll just stick to the same old, same old, that has everybody complaining about how down the conference is right now |
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Post by cardsfan606 on Feb 27, 2024 13:32:32 GMT -6
name any other established FBS school that geographically makes sense, has FBS football, that we could get right now. THAT is true. Doesn't make it good idea to go that way is the point. I would agree with that regarding umass, but we’re already here. Western Kentucky is the closest thing we’ll get to a home |
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Post by cardsfan606 on Feb 27, 2024 13:34:25 GMT -6
There will never be a direct 1:1 positive correlation for us and conference realignment. Adding a non-MAC school like WKU is good because it exposes BSU has a brand to more eyeballs (the state of Kentucky in this case). We have to hope that expanding our footprint in different markets leads to a benefit down the line, not in the immediate future. That’s why Stony Brook is intriguing. NYC market for the MAC? Worked out well for the Big Ten and Rutgers. For basketball specifically I’d think that could be a selling point. I know it’s Long Island and not downtown NYC, but we can’t be picky. Stoneybrook is a cool idea, but I’m going to veto it due to the fact that they’re 2-19 in football over the past two years |
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Post by JacksonStreetElite on Feb 27, 2024 13:47:59 GMT -6
If you don’t understand that right now, then I can’t help you. Look at every other conference in collegiate sports at the FBS level. There have been 15 schools jump up from FCS to FBS over the past handful of years. With Delaware and Kennesaw state for sure moving up and now Tarlton State being rumored as well. With the Big 10 moving up to 18 schools, and all of these FCS schools moving up it’s inevitable. I’m more traditional, and would prefer 12 member conferences with divisions, but everything is moving away from this, and I don’t want to get left behind. Arguably we already have by the Sunbelt. I remember when the Sunbelt used to be the bottom feeder and now they’re the top group of five school in football. And your whole mentality of why even expand has us in the position we’re in now. Is UMass a great ad no. But reading through some of their stuff. It sounds like they actually have a decent head coach now, and they have money being invested into the football program. More than us. Additionally, Frank Martin is their basketball coach right now and they seem like they have a lot of potential. Ok. You asked me to think critically. So let's pick this apart. Look at every other conference in collegiate sports at the FBS level. We already covered the weakness of the "everyone else is doing this" argument. Is there more to this point that I'm missing? There have been 15 schools jump up from FCS to FBS over the past handful of years. With Delaware and Kennesaw state for sure moving up and now Tarlton State being rumored as well. I'm not sure why this mandates conferences to expand. Sure there might be good fits that mutually benefit all parties where an upcoming school needs a home and brings value to the table, but all the schools we're discussing here are already D1. I'd evaluate any school on an ad hoc basis, and support it if it benefitted us. With the Big 10 moving up to 18 schools, and all of these FCS schools moving up it’s inevitable. I don't understand how it becomes inevitable. First of all, the B10 is a totally different beast. People actually want to see UCLA vs. Michigan. They actually generate money via their programs. Second, how do FCS schools moving up mean that we have to give them a shot at our conference title? I’m more traditional, and would prefer 12 member conferences with divisions, but everything is moving away from this, and I don’t want to get left behind. How is continuing as we are "being left behind"? Arguably we already have by the Sunbelt. I remember when the Sunbelt used to be the bottom feeder and now they’re the top group of five school in football. First, how did the Sun Belt reach this majestic mountaintop of being the top G5 conference? Second, that is all great for fans of the "Sunbelt," but I'm guessing there are few fans who particularly care about the conference itself. Do the fans of the bottom feeder schools in the Sunbelt receive any real benefits by their top teams having the prestige of being the top G5 conference? And your whole mentality of why even expand has us in the position we’re in now. I said I'm willing to have my mind changed. I'm not opposed to expansion, I'm opposed to expansion for expansion's sake. I literally have not seen a single persuasive argument how this actually benefits us. Well then by all means, full steam ahead. But reading through some of their stuff. It sounds like they actually have a decent head coach now, and they have money being invested into the football program. More than us. Good for them, how does that benefit us? Additionally, Frank Martin is their basketball coach right now and they seem like they have a lot of potential. Good for them, how does that benefit us? Was that thinking critical enough for you? |
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Post by mattg on Feb 27, 2024 14:00:52 GMT -6
It does appear that ESPN will shell out more money for larger conference inventories, aka more teams. Perhaps that is what our MAC leadership is thinking? Obviously the question of quality vs quantity will be weighed as well. Our conference “quality” is not necessarily the caliber of athletes and teams, it’s the willingness to play football games on Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday.
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Post by cardfan on Feb 27, 2024 14:07:22 GMT -6
It does appear that ESPN will shell out more money for larger conference inventories, aka more teams. Perhaps that is what our MAC leadership is thinking? Obviously the question of quality vs quantity will be weighed as well. Our conference “quality” is not necessarily the caliber of athletes and teams, it’s the willingness to play football games on Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday. So far the MAC's contracts with ESPN have been for relative pennies. Adding more schools might up the ante, but it would still have to be spread amongst more schools. I doubt the contract the MAC could get would result in significantly more dollars, unless somehow the commish convinces ESPN that extremely mediocre teams playing in empty stadiums in bad weather on week nights will be super lucrative... |
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Post by Lurkin McGurkin on Feb 27, 2024 14:13:39 GMT -6
It does appear that ESPN will shell out more money for larger conference inventories, aka more teams. Perhaps that is what our MAC leadership is thinking? Obviously the question of quality vs quantity will be weighed as well. Our conference “quality” is not necessarily the caliber of athletes and teams, it’s the willingness to play football games on Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday. They already have plenty of inventory on ESPN+. They will put literally ANYTHING on there. Any additional money that ESPN pays will be split by more teams, so that's a wash. More travel expenses will eat up any additional revenue anyway. I don't see UMASS as a good addition. Their basketball is historically decent, but not for quite a while now. Football is a train wreck. Other sports, not enough people care for it to matter, except for hockey, which isn't a MAC sport anyway. Bigger market? Maybe, if they think they can make inroads into Boston, but it's 70 miles away. Kind of like thinking BSU would draw the Indy market. Unless we're going to pick up WKU, Ill State, and ND State as well... I'm not seeing the value. |
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Post by JacksonStreetElite on Feb 27, 2024 14:13:48 GMT -6
It does appear that ESPN will shell out more money for larger conference inventories, aka more teams. Perhaps that is what our MAC leadership is thinking? Obviously the question of quality vs quantity will be weighed as well. Our conference “quality” is not necessarily the caliber of athletes and teams, it’s the willingness to play football games on Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday. So far the MAC's contracts with ESPN have been for relative pennies. Adding more schools might up the ante, but it would still have to be spread amongst more schools. I doubt the contract the MAC could get would result in significantly more dollars, unless somehow the commish convinces ESPN that extremely mediocre teams playing in empty stadiums in bad weather on week nights will be super lucrative... Yeah, "we get more money from this" would be the most persuasive argument yet for this. But if it's actually that the conference gets a little more money that gets spread among more parties resulting in no actual additional money coming to us, then it's a nonstarter. Granted I have no idea how the TV contracts work, but I don't see why ESPN is going to roll out the red carpet to get the rights to put EMU vs. UMass on the internet. |
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Post by rmcalhoun on Feb 27, 2024 14:50:32 GMT -6
Lots of arguing but tge answer is simple for the MAC to remain in the fight it has to expand. This is not about the schools in the mac its about survival of the conference. If the conference survives we survive inside of it. Now we all know the MAC will eventually lose but the front office is the Alamo
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Post by JacksonStreetElite on Feb 27, 2024 14:55:17 GMT -6
Lots of arguing but tge answer is simple for the MAC to remain in the fight it has to expand. This is not about the schools in the mac its about survival of the conference. If the conference survives we survive inside of it. Now we all know the MAC will eventually lose but the front office is the Alamo Why? |
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Post by 00hmh on Feb 27, 2024 14:56:12 GMT -6
ESPN payment in the past may be lousy evidence about the future.
As the giant conferences set themselves apart, you'll see what we've seen with the NFL. GOOD teams playing on weeknights.
Even B10 and SEC bottom teams have bigger potential TV audience. Top teams will fill their stadium for weeknight big games. And TV. Do you thing they'll pass up that revenue?
How will MACtion compete?
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Post by villagepub on Feb 27, 2024 14:59:21 GMT -6
Don't like UMASS. I like WKU. UMASS helps to increase the MAC academic ranking. Adding WKU negates the academic addition of UMASS. WKU could pull MTSU. But, I guess beggars can't be choosers. JMU and ODU should've been targeted by the MAC when they were still FCS. |
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Post by villagepub on Feb 27, 2024 15:13:24 GMT -6
There will never be a direct 1:1 positive correlation for us and conference realignment. Adding a non-MAC school like WKU is good because it exposes BSU has a brand to more eyeballs (the state of Kentucky in this case). We have to hope that expanding our footprint in different markets leads to a benefit down the line, not in the immediate future. That’s why Stony Brook is intriguing. NYC market for the MAC? Worked out well for the Big Ten and Rutgers. For basketball specifically I’d think that could be a selling point. I know it’s Long Island and not downtown NYC, but we can’t be picky. Bring in Colgate, half way between Buffalo and UMass. |
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