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Post by 00hmh on Feb 14, 2018 8:50:56 GMT -6
It’s fantastic to get these wins but they are only part of the journey, not the destination. Some of us would really like to finally reach the destination again but know the team tends to take the wrong exit just when you think they’ve arrived. Have to keep going and not celebrate ALMOST getting there. OK. But, you have not been on the road with my family if you think the destination is the only part of the trip you can enjoy. It doesn't mean you shouldn't enjoy the journey. A loss is nothing to celebrate, but even a wrong turn on your road trip sometimes leads to some out of the way place you enjoy even if you are late to the ultimate destination. Planning efficiently to get there is important. That's where I agree we have to keep the destination in mind. Our travel planning in previous attempts has often been pretty inept, especially scheduling the flight with Crash Thompson as the pilot. And, generally our travel agent has given us a bus ticket not first class tickets, notably in the recent trip with Billy Ball Travel. This road trip metaphor makes me think about the summers when you don't have the budget to go by direct flight and have to spend 15 hours in the car with the kids. And I admit thinking of it as a family vacation, we may have been on the National Lampoon version too much over the last 15 years, but still...
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Post by cardfan on Feb 14, 2018 8:55:45 GMT -6
We all know Clark Griswald could screw this thing up at any moment.....
What I was trying to say was these wins a great and we should enjoy them, BUT, we should not suddenly think we've gotten where we need to go because we've won a couple. We still gotta get there. And we've seen too often that our highs are followed by some lows that shouldn't have happened but the sleepwalking returned.
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Post by 00hmh on Feb 14, 2018 9:00:02 GMT -6
@toledombb holds on for the victory over @ohiombasketball. The Rockets remain 3 games ahead of second place Ball State in the West Division of the @macsports. A win over Ball State Saturday would clinch at least a tie for first place for Toledo in the MAC West Division. We are going to need a win and help to even think about a second seed Ccertainly true that BSU has to win out and count on Toledo to fold like a tent to have any shot at a top 2 seed. 2-3% chance at that. However, I'm glad there is a realistic path to retaining a 3 seed, and I could be content with that. Granted I hope someone like Miami OH doesn't end up as a 6 seed. We are not getting to a 2 seed. At the start of the year I thought we were a top 2 or 3 team, outside chance we became very good might win he conference regular season. Buffalo has been terrific, Toledo put together a good team. Our losses of players should mean we are in a dog fight for a 3 seed and that after everything that happened we are still in the mix for a 3, looks like on the top of the heap, is pretty good and a credit to the players and coach. I'd like to see Miami again, I don't like playing Eastern, though we owe them some payback, too, but with our game based on inside play, I don't like playing against he zone without outside shooting and without the depth to force the pace.
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Post by cardfan on Feb 14, 2018 9:06:45 GMT -6
I think a 3 is the best we can do at this point. I don't think I'd want to face EMU again either and they are playing well. Miami is coming back to level and I wouldn't mind playing them again. I think. Then again.....
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Post by 00hmh on Feb 14, 2018 9:11:10 GMT -6
We all know Clark Griswald could screw this thing up at any moment..... What I was trying to say was these wins a great and we should enjoy them, BUT, we should not suddenly think we've gotten where we need to go because we've won a couple. We still gotta get there. And we've seen too often that our highs are followed by some lows that shouldn't have happened but the sleepwalking returned. That is "Mark" Griswald in this case, perhaps, but the planning is usually the best part of the vacation idea in those movies. Such good ideas, derailed by a curse as strong as the BSU curse. I agree completely that we have to keep our eye on the road and not forget how much trouble we could get into if we don't. And however much we blame Clark/Mark for the itinerary, those family members certainly give us reasons to blame them. But as I said we can enjoy the trip even as we worry about making the next turn.
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Post by Bigfoot on Feb 14, 2018 9:38:55 GMT -6
Persons is one of those players that can be very tough to coach but is a fierce competitor and finds a way to win. You want him on your side at crunch time.They say Scott Skiles was the same way at Michigan State. Yes - I watched Skiles in HS and in college and Persons is very similar in many respects. Never will forget the Plymouth game against Gary Roosevelt in the state tournament Skiles senior year!
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Post by rmcalhoun on Feb 14, 2018 9:44:48 GMT -6
Whit had his hand forced into using this new rotation which features Moses and Teague out there together a lot. It has also moved Teague down around the block more. Do you think after seeing the success of it he will stick with it next year?
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Post by Hoopsmith on Feb 14, 2018 9:50:56 GMT -6
Persons is one of those players that can be very tough to coach but is a fierce competitor and finds a way to win. You want him on your side at crunch time.They say Scott Skiles was the same way at Michigan State. That is an excellent analogy as long as it is confined to on-court play, which is why I liked it. For all of his strengths as a player, Skiles had to be an absolute nightmare for a (college) coach. A couple of drug arrests and a DUI. By most accounts, Tayler is a great person off the floor.
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Post by cardfan on Feb 14, 2018 9:55:50 GMT -6
Whit had his hand forced into using this new rotation which features Moses and Teague out there together a lot. It has also moved Teague down around the block more. Do you think after seeing the success of it he will stick with it next year? Kinda sucks whit couldn’t see this was our best lineup without being forced to go with it. If not for suspensions and boots we’d probably still be bringing Teague off the bench to shoot 3’s. Would like the coach to show better instinct and feel than he did up to that point. At any rate I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if he went away from it again next year despite the great results Moses and Teague are having together. Wildcards are how Hazen and Walton are used and if the freshmen are good enough to see time. We should be really good next year if we find some guts to hit perimeter shots consistently enough.
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Post by Bigfoot on Feb 14, 2018 9:55:55 GMT -6
Whit had his hand forced into using this new rotation which features Moses and Teague out there together a lot. It has also moved Teague down around the block more. Do you think after seeing the success of it he will stick with it next year? Hard to say when you mix in the skill set of the new and continually maturing current roster. I have to say that I like the size the recent starting lineup offers. Those 5 have some very good skill sets, can still present a formidable threat from 3 but also be very productive on the boards. I am pleased with how the staff has developed these guys individually and as a team. Probably most impressed with the effort Sean Sellers has brought to the floor during MAC play.
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Post by cardfan on Feb 14, 2018 9:56:51 GMT -6
Persons is one of those players that can be very tough to coach but is a fierce competitor and finds a way to win. You want him on your side at crunch time.They say Scott Skiles was the same way at Michigan State. That is an excellent analogy as long as it is confined to on-court play, which is why I liked it. For all of his strengths as a player, Skiles had to be an absolute nightmare for a (college) coach. A couple of drug arrests and a DUI. By most accounts, Tayler is a great person off the floor. Very true. Skiles had issues. We almost got Skiles to Bsu.
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Post by Hoopsmith on Feb 14, 2018 10:45:35 GMT -6
That is an excellent analogy as long as it is confined to on-court play, which is why I liked it. For all of his strengths as a player, Skiles had to be an absolute nightmare for a (college) coach. A couple of drug arrests and a DUI. By most accounts, Tayler is a great person off the floor. Very true. Skiles had issues. We almost got Skiles to Bsu. You serious Clark? As a fan going back to that era, I love to think of Skiles here. The thought of him willingly sharing the basketball with Palombizio and Al Brown keeping both egos in check gives me great pause, however.
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Post by BSU Card Fan in AZ on Feb 14, 2018 10:46:09 GMT -6
Only one team makes it out of things alive at seasons end, so enjoy the great wins along the way. Stats say you will not make it out most likely. A lot of things have to fall your way unless you are just a dominating force. No one except possibly Buffalo falls into that category. It’s a craps shoot at best this year.
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Post by 00hmh on Feb 14, 2018 10:46:37 GMT -6
Whit had his hand forced into using this new rotation which features Moses and Teague out there together a lot. It has also moved Teague down around the block more. Do you think after seeing the success of it he will stick with it next year? This was always a big part of the plan on using Teague, from day 1. I never bought the criticism of Teague as a pure wing player, but he was never going to be an old fashioned PF either. I believe this year the plan from the start was to play them together much more than we actually did, but less than we are now. This was partly because of the injury to Trey, but also because we expected MUCH more from Francis (another injury, too) and from our other guards including the departed duo. This plan never got out of the gate. Trey had played very much like he is playing now this summer, not a complete beast in the MAC (all the criticism of his short comings are valid enough) but still a guy who could score inside when he was guarded by most of the opposing big men. He has finally gotten back to that point. Playing him without Teague was always and this year should be part of the plan. Mostly to deal with lack of depth and foul trouble. And to be fair, everyone expected better play especially better outside shooting which would make space for scoring in the lane by guards, utilizing Trey's passing. Trey being out of action, and then having to play limited minutes forced a very awkward adjustment, it meant they could not plan on time for Moses. That happened right out of the box. When he came back, he wasn't the same guy and the original game plan had to be adjusted even then. With him in more P&R and scoring on the drive by Persons et al at guard. Teague was never going to be a big post up threat by himself, still isn't exactly that now. But there was also a desirability to playing Teague and Trey separately, that second unit played well with him coming off the bench with Tyler, not a bad plan. As for Teague, he is a guy with a very good first step and would be a nightmare if he was hitting even the same from outside as he did last year. He worked all summer on spot shooting, but we've seen he just never got untracked in games. To be as good as he can he has to still work on that. While he plays VERY well in tandem with Trey, he is not a guy you can play in the post where he roots his position and gets the ball low, he has to be moving and beat his man to the block, get the pass, and quickly score before help arrives. Trey seems to really see how that works, and of course he also benefits playing with Teague whose defender is moving with him and has trouble helping on Trey. And if he does, Trey can pass inside. Next year? Trey, Teague together maybe half the game? With the guys we will have who can drive to the basket, I like Trey who is pretty good at the high post setting that ball screen, so if he can keep up the good post play we will be able to play him without Teague as an option. This will work better than earlier in the year when we did that. Teague coming in where we have depth will allow us to run with Walton, high energy defense, and so on. Still, next year I agree we will see more of them playing together than this year, a little less than right now. We'll have more and better depth up front, both Hazen and Mallers who can substitute. This year it was just Mallers and Gunn if we played both together so much. Plus, Mallers has played well, you need to give him minutes. I'd guess 4 those 4 pretty good players up front sharing 90-100+ minutes, mix and match, with Gunn getting some time along with 3 guards some of the time to fill out 120 minutes.
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Post by 00hmh on Feb 14, 2018 10:53:07 GMT -6
Whit had his hand forced into using this new rotation which features Moses and Teague out there together a lot. It has also moved Teague down around the block more. Do you think after seeing the success of it he will stick with it next year? Hard to say when you mix in the skill set of the new and continually maturing current roster. I have to say that I like the size the recent starting lineup offers. Those 5 have some very good skill sets, can still present a formidable threat from 3 but also be very productive on the boards. I am pleased with how the staff has developed these guys individually and as a team. Probably most impressed with the effort Sean Sellers has brought to the floor during MAC play. The staff does deserve a lot of coaching credit for making so many different adjustments as they have been required to do. Whitford in year 1 and 2 could not do that as well and did not handle game coaching as well. Sean has done very well. He has gone from being a primary scoring threat with the offense to some extent designed for him to being a threat to open the court for others, with no guarantee of a lot of shots, to now being an even lower priority to score as Mallers as become improved. He really shows how smart he is as a player and how well he can play basketball, and given us an even higher level of energy this year.
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