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Post by 00hmh on Dec 3, 2021 6:44:35 GMT -6
The wall is expensive and there is ample evidence walls don't work. By far the greatest amount of drugs enter elsewhere.
This is not a quick fix if it worked... would take years and require guards and maintenance.
Suppose it worked at the margin, other existing routes would be used and the flow would go elsewhere to new routes.
There is too much profit to think this can be stopped on one border or cheaply. We have very long borders North and South and on the coasts.
Success would raise the price slightly.
Vaccine and mitigation works quickly to reduce deaths. Your argument is totally bogus we need to build a wall not fight Covid.
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Post by sweep on Dec 3, 2021 6:58:28 GMT -6
....... there is ample evidence walls don't work. By far the greatest amount of drugs enter elsewhere. Yeah right, walls don't work. That's why there are walls and fences around everything important that require security and protection. 00 must be for open campus prisons or something. "By far the greatest amount of drugs enter elsewhere.".................Correct they enter where are are no walls or other forms of lax security. Seriously are you actually as dumb as you appear or is this just an act. |
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 3, 2021 9:30:15 GMT -6
....... there is ample evidence walls don't work. By far the greatest amount of drugs enter elsewhere. Yeah right, walls don't work. That's why there are walls and fences around everything important that require security and protection. 00 must be for open campus prisons or something. "By far the greatest amount of drugs enter elsewhere.".................Correct they enter where are are no walls and lax security. Really? What are you thinking of that shows promise on this scale? Do you have any idea how expensive prison walls are? Are you seriously proposing a 2000 mile war patrolled at that expense? We do have effective prison walls, but do you really think prisons have no drug problem?
You are just being foolish here.
Walls work to enclose and protect small areas, they work well but not without maintenance and patrol. Fort Knox we cannot make the Southern border...
Can you name any city or country in the world that has built such a wall and maintained it that you want to emulate? Korean DMZ maybe? Berlin Wall?
Bsutrack is right that fentanyl smuggling is a big threat. Southern border interdiction shows mass amounts of drugs much harder to transport and much easier to detect entering. This where we already have a wall, plus stringent immigration restrictions, and DEA actively working. VERY small amounts are significant which makes it VERY hard to stop.
Your giant wall will have to be similarly patrolled constantly and you could not expect to stop fentanyl. A smuggler need not go through the wall but literally could throw pounds of the substance over it to confederates.
If security elsewhere is so lax, how do you plan to solve that problem? Drugs enter the country by sea and air across our borders on all sides. You building a wall on the Canadian border, along Florida beaches, East, West and Gulf coast too? How high a wall to stop air traffic? C'mon my friend, unless you patrol constantly every inch of border this is not a simple job.
By the way, this drug and close chemical substitutes can be manufactured HERE, and distributed. Granted all this effort can make the drug more expensive.
If you want to stop drug deaths, it's pretty hard to do more than raise the price to the end user by marginally cutting current supply routes. I don't have the answer but neither has any administration in our history.
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 3, 2021 9:42:47 GMT -6
....... there is ample evidence walls don't work. By far the greatest amount of drugs enter elsewhere. Yeah right, walls don't work....00 must be for open campus prisons or something. Well if the success of our current prison system is the model for effectively stopping drug trade you are in trouble...
But back the point of stopping drug deaths compared to fighting Covid, I am pretty sure we could spend money better and get quicker results on drug deaths spending our money on something else other than a wall.
How many deaths do you think you are preventing with this boondoggle. How quickly?
As opposed to the rather low cost of vaccination and mitigation of Covid this year? With most deaths prevented there being innocent citizens who are not voluntarily putting themselves in danger?
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Post by sweep on Dec 3, 2021 9:44:56 GMT -6
00 is building a new home with no exterior walls because they are too expensive and don't provide cost effective security.
Your party doesn't oppose walls at the border because they don't work, they simply have a childish aversion to the optics. It's all about "not looking mean", instead of actually solving problems. Grow-up..........Seriously what an idiot.
Why Oh Why, did I click on the button to read his post ? What was I thinking ?
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 4, 2021 11:06:41 GMT -6
00 is building a new home with no exterior walls because they are too expensive and don't provide cost effective security. I have skipped high expensive walls around the acre of yard. I'll come over to your place to see the Ft Apache plan. |
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Post by sweep on Dec 4, 2021 11:29:25 GMT -6
00 is building a new home with no exterior walls because they are too expensive and don't provide cost effective security. I have skipped high expensive walls around the acre of yard. I'll come over to your place to see the Ft Apache plan. No dumbass, "exterior walls" not a wall around your property. |
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 4, 2021 12:27:47 GMT -6
I have skipped high expensive walls around the acre of yard. I'll come over to your place to see the Ft Apache plan. No dumbass, "exterior walls" not a wall around your property. But aren't you arguing for a wall around our national property? Or are you just arguing without any real point? |
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Post by sweep on Dec 4, 2021 13:07:40 GMT -6
No dumbass, "exterior walls" not a wall around your property. But aren't you arguing for a wall around our national property? Or are you just arguing without any real point? You are just way too stupid to have a conversation with. Jesus..............I am once again done reading your posts. |
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 4, 2021 15:04:03 GMT -6
But aren't you arguing for a wall around our national property? Or are you just arguing without any real point? You are just way too stupid to have a conversation with. Jesus..............I am once again done reading your posts. You're perhaps right. I must be missing something to not recognize your argument that your home and steps to secure it is similar to the problems on the Mexican border. That one was a tour de force. |
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Post by bsutrack on Dec 5, 2021 0:23:15 GMT -6
Can you name any city or country in the world that has built such a wall and maintained it that you want to emulate? Korean DMZ maybe? Berlin Wall?
The Great Wall of China worked pretty well in keeping the Western Barbarians (our forefathers) out of China for over a thousand years. Today Israel has build and maintains an extensive wall and fence system keeping them safe from their Arab neighbors. It seems they got annoyed enough with their citizens being blown-up by Palestinian Terrorists they thought the cost was worth it. Israel isn't the most wealthy nation on Earth. You can do a lot these days with camera systems and remote sensors that the Chinese of the Ming Dynasty lacked to reduce the cost. One of the articles I quoted from earlier stated the funding Trump requested for the southern wall was $10 billion. I'm going to assume this was the amounted needed for it's construction; otherwise, he would have requested more. How much did he actually get completed? With all the lawsuits thrown-up by Liberals to stop it, probably wasn't much. I'm guessing maybe 20%. Add in the $2 billion so far wasted by Biden on paying contractors not to build it, maybe 40% could be completed by now. The second of the two articles I quoted from mentioned Biden had request $11 billion in next year's budget to pay for drug treatment. One would think if the flow of drugs could be reduced even 10 to 30%, you could save a few billion off that $11 billion for drug treatment and more than pay for wall maintenance. I still think that most of the drugs smuggled into this country avoid points of entry. The only drugs interdicted happen there. If I were a drug smuggler, I wouldn't move my product through places I could get caught. It's only common sense to smuggle it through open gaps in the southern border. The other item I want to highlight in the second article was how the Biden Administration wasn't requesting any additional funding for Border Patrol in the same budget he was requesting $11 billion for drug treatment. To circle back (Jen Psaki's favorite line) to Covid-19, this would be like saying we will not have vaccines for Covid-19, but only fund therapeutics to treat you once you have contracted Covid-19. We don't want to spend more money on attempting to stop the flow of drugs into the USA, but we'll spend $11 billion once you have become addicted. Why would anyone have such a policy? My only explanation is additional spending on Border Patrol and constructing a southern wall would mess-up the flow of Illegals into the country. Illegals that someday will become Democratic Voters. So back to my thesis, that the increased drug overdoses are just causalities in the Biden's Administrations desire for open borders and future Democratic Voters. On final thought on walls, someday there will be another terrorist attack in the USA. It's only a matter of time especially now that the Taliban are in control of Afghanistan again. When it happens, if the terrorists for the attack have come across the southern border, those responsible (yes the Joe Biden Administration most likely) will have hell to pay. |
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Post by bsutrack on Dec 5, 2021 0:53:02 GMT -6
If security elsewhere is so lax, how do you plan to solve that problem? Drugs enter the country by sea and air across our borders on all sides. You building a wall on the Canadian border, along Florida beaches, East, West and Gulf coast too? How high a wall to stop air traffic? C'mon my friend, unless you patrol constantly every inch of border this is not a simple job.
You don't have the same drug cartels in Canada. I just don't foresee the Canadians ever losing total control of their country like the Mexicans have. As for the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans, they are pretty effective barriers to bringing in drugs. There is also the US Coast Guard which is pretty effective at interdicting drugs coming into the country. I believe that is one of their missions and why we pay taxes to maintain the US Coast Guard. |
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 5, 2021 3:06:46 GMT -6
The great wall of China?
You do realize that wall was manned by armed forces and how much of the empires military budget it consumed to man. Not to mention coat of construction.
This is the prison wall model. You oppose the infrastructure bill and support this unproductive investment and permanent commitment?
What is cost benefit compared to masks and vax to prevent more needless deaths?
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Post by sweep on Dec 5, 2021 8:18:01 GMT -6
For Christ's Sake, if walls didn't work the Democrat Party would be all for using them along the entire southern border. The fact is modern liberals don't see illegal immigrants as unwanted intruders. They openly encourage lawless intrusion. It's all about strengthening the Democrat Party, 24/7 365, who cares if it causes chaos, strife, and lowers our standard of living.
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 5, 2021 12:11:14 GMT -6
For Christ's Sake, if walls didn't work the Democrat Party would be all for using them along the entire southern border. The fact is modern liberals don't see illegal immigrants as unwanted intruders. We were talking walls as a bogus way to cut drug deaths cost effectively.
For immigration we need a comprehensive reform of policy, not walls.
We need immigration to fill jobs nobody else wants and due to population demographics/
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