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Post by 00hmh on Oct 4, 2016 6:11:29 GMT -6
Ideally we'd start the year with 4 guards 2 or 3 wing forwards and 4 bigger players. You couldn't play everybody quite enough, might almost prefer a couple of those guys were role players.
Red shirt 2 or holding back scholarship fine then.
Tyler out, not the plan, makes 4, is too many sitting first semester for sure. I can see a shirt for a wing player, Hollywood or Mallers, plus Walker.
Not sure either if those guys give us much as as an inside defender. So, no real benefit to use both, rather go small.
Not ideal. Life is a bitch. We just have to make it work.
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Post by 00hmh on Oct 4, 2016 6:15:06 GMT -6
Yeah, and is there anyone in the 16 class, that is so special, they can't be recreated or recruited over in the 17 class. If not, what the point of red-shirting ? By MAC season we're probably OK. Don't see much gain playing both Mallers and Hollywood. Why? What point playing them a few minutes? Unless we suffer injury, then burn the shirt
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Post by 00hmh on Oct 4, 2016 6:19:16 GMT -6
Odds probably better for us than Sherman worries about that we suffer serious injury, but it is a problem. We all agree we wish we had another big guy, and now another guard. Can probably cover up, but it will cost us something.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 6:20:25 GMT -6
Yeah, and is there anyone in the 16 class, that is so special, they can't be recreated or recruited over in the 17 class. If not, what the point of red-shirting ? By MAC season we're probably OK. Don't see much gain playing both Mallers and Hollywood. Why? What point playing them a few minutes? Unless we suffer injury, then burn the shirt Yeah and what exactly is the point of keeping either one of those guys around for five years.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 6:22:01 GMT -6
Odds probably better for us than Sherman worries about that we suffer serious injury, but it is a problem. We all agree we wish we had another big guy, and now another guard. Can probably cover up, but it will cost us something. It doesn't have to be a serious injury, losing the wrong guy for ten days due to mild sprain could be a real problem.
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Post by 00hmh on Oct 4, 2016 6:24:57 GMT -6
That I can't agree with. Premature to say either way. You recruit to develop players, we aren't always going to get sure fire 3 year starters, ready as freshman.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 6:30:56 GMT -6
That I can't agree with. Premature to say either way. You recruit to develop players, we aren't always going to get sure fire 3 year starters, ready as freshman. If either of those guys blossom into a special player, they are going to use the grad school exemption and transfer for their final year anyway. You act like players don't develop if they aren't red-shirted ?
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Post by 00hmh on Oct 4, 2016 7:10:21 GMT -6
That I can't agree with. Premature to say either way. You recruit to develop players, we aren't always going to get sure fire 3 year starters, ready as freshman. If either of those guys blossoms into a special player, they are going to use the grad school exemption and transfer for their final year anyway. You act like players don't develop if they aren't red-shirted ? Look what you are saying. If a player isn't a "special" player you shouldn't invest time in him. C'mon. We get a "special" player not that often. We build good teams with solid starter quality players, and a few special players. Some of those develop after a year or two. Like maybe Teague, or Moses, or Franko. Or this year it could be Kiapway or Sellers. Both of these recruits have good chances to be MAC starter quality players. We should maximize the chance of that and having them contribute more for 3 or 4 years on the court. It is of course a cost benefit decision. Little benefit to play both these guys a few minutes a game this year. The cost we don't know, but why guess about it? Wait a year. If you get a special player at their position you sign him anyway. They become good depth. Besides. If we really need both, then red shirt status is not something you can't change in mid season. Where we would NOT red shirt someone (like maybe a guard, with Tyler out, or a raw boned big guy who was rough around the edges but able to get in and bang around down low) is if we knew we would need them 10 minutes a game and could give them that PT and also fill a need.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 7:41:19 GMT -6
"Look what you are saying. If a player isn't a "special" player you shouldn't invest time in him"
I quit reading your post at that asinine opening sentence. Anyone with an IQ over 80 would realize that isn't what I said or came anywhere close to insinuating.
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Post by williamtsherman on Oct 4, 2016 8:03:05 GMT -6
I think the developmental redshirt can be a success at times, but it is certainly no sure thing, and there are risks.
I am not able to remember any successes we've had doing this, but I can think of a few failures - Rashaun Richardson being the most recent. I believe Ray tried it a couple times and it never worked for him (e.g. Mark Ferris? Steve Smith?). I may be missing some. Can anyone think of a case where this DID work? I'm not saying you should never do it, but you have to understand it may not work out.
I definitely think that two cases of this when you already have a transfer sitting our is too many. Note that he risk involved was already evident on DAY FREAKING ONE.
And the more I think about it, the more I am sure that the odds of another player injury/suspension are way over 50% for the conference season. The link below suggests that an average NBA team loses around 150 player games per (82 game) season. This means a typical NBA team on a typical night is missing two players. Not an apples to apples comparison, I know, but it certainly does back up my sense that it is quite unlikely for us to go through the whole conference season without one of our rotation players missing games. And with three redshirts, we would immediately be in crises mode.....and you know who will immediately start telling us how Whitford is just the victim of "bad luck". Maybe this gamble, like the California sojourn, is a consequence of the contract extension.
NBA injuries site
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 8:23:13 GMT -6
There is another issue as well. Eventually you will create unbalanced classes where you will have six or seven true Freshman.
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Post by 00hmh on Oct 4, 2016 10:27:03 GMT -6
There is another issue as well. Eventually you will create unbalanced classes where you will have six or seven true Freshman. That is a good point, but so far the red shirt/5th year senior/transfer process is actually not doing that. And that unbalanced class thing sometimes works out pretty well. This year is the first one where if we have 2 redshirt players and 4 recruits we would have an imbalance. OTOH if they are all good players, I can live with that and we would be looking at a couple of MAC contender/championship teams a couple of years down the line with strong upper class presence. Assum 6 seniors, on a very good team. Still 7 players coming back with experience the next year. And that next recruiting class might contain a JUCO or two and would likely be a very good one. Successful program, lots of PT coming on line. This is a good discussion but I am not worried about too many good players right now...more the other problems raised about short term depth issues. Look at it this way. Suppose we chose Bo Calhoun to red shirt his freshman year. We'd have had him on this team this year and solve a lot of depth problems!
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Post by 00hmh on Oct 4, 2016 10:28:54 GMT -6
When this program is firing on all cylinders and deep in talent, then I'll worry more about keeping "merely" good players 5 years.
When we can go out and get a "special" player every year, or maybe 2, then I'll worry less about developing players.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 11:09:19 GMT -6
We're DOOMED, DOOMED, I tell you!!! 🔥🌪🌩💨
Oh, sorry. I was watching the Weather Channel......
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2016 11:16:37 GMT -6
When this program is firing on all cylinders and deep in talent, then I'll worry more about keeping "merely" good players 5 years. When will this be?
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