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Post by universityjim on Dec 3, 2019 22:59:44 GMT -6
I still think basketball is an easier fix than a D1 football program. With that said, tonight's debacle showed a team in TOTAL disarray. If we win 10 games I will be shocked. That is a pathetic D1 basketball program. Thats funny cause I was just walking in from the kitchen thinking about what was harder football or basketball.. I had decided it would be tougher to fix a football team. Whit got us out of the cellar which is good but if this continues we are going to be right back going down the steps We are on the way back down. There must be action after this season.
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Post by TakeMeBackto2008 on Dec 3, 2019 23:32:48 GMT -6
I still think basketball is an easier fix than a D1 football program. With that said, tonight's debacle showed a team in TOTAL disarray. If we win 10 games I will be shocked. That is a pathetic D1 basketball program. Thats funny cause I was just walking in from the kitchen thinking about what was harder football or basketball.. I had decided it would be tougher to fix a football team. Whit got us out of the cellar which is good but if this continues we are going to be right back going down the steps We were a .500 team in Taylor's last two seasons. Whitford brought us back up from the cellar after he pushed us down there, kicked us around, then clumsily dragged us back up.
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Post by universityjim on Dec 3, 2019 23:41:31 GMT -6
Thats funny cause I was just walking in from the kitchen thinking about what was harder football or basketball.. I had decided it would be tougher to fix a football team. Whit got us out of the cellar which is good but if this continues we are going to be right back going down the steps We were a .500 team in Taylor's last two seasons. Whitford brought us back up from the cellar after he pushed us down there, kicked us around, then clumsily dragged us back up. And to think, I actually said hi to him at Starbucks once.
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Post by rmcalhoun on Dec 4, 2019 0:43:36 GMT -6
Living in Muncie and being roughly the same age as the current fb and Bb staffs. I have gotten to now a lot of our current coaches. I coach their kids, I see them at school, some live in my neighborhood. My son and daughters are friends with their kids. Almost all of them both basketball and football are really nice people. When I happen to be around them I make it a point not to talk BSU sports because I do not think they should have to or want to talk about that in those settings. I might say good luck or great game but that's about it. I talk to them like I would talk to any other parent. Ive had less of these conversations with whit than the others but I swear to you trying to even have the smallest of talk with him is one of the most awkward conversations you will ever have. Do not get me wrong he is nice enough and never rude but he is just a weird dude. I do not know how he talks to a recruit maybe he is different in that setting but I just cant imagine it
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Post by Deleted on Dec 4, 2019 6:49:32 GMT -6
Thats funny cause I was just walking in from the kitchen thinking about what was harder football or basketball.. I had decided it would be tougher to fix a football team. Whit got us out of the cellar which is good but if this continues we are going to be right back going down the steps We were a .500 team in Taylor's last two seasons. Whitford brought us back up from the cellar after he pushed us down there, kicked us around, then clumsily dragged us back up. Ding, ding, ding!!! Beat me to it.
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Post by bsutrack on Dec 4, 2019 7:23:07 GMT -6
If Whit were to be fired at the end of the season (or before), he'll likely be leaving a roster worse than the one he inherited (at least in terms of how he's using his current roster). Might Hazen, Gunn, Hendricks, Huggins or Thomas be developed/better used by another coach? Possibly, but it'll clearly be on the next staff to do it. At least he'll have 3 scholarships to try to get some help immediately and three more to work on for next fall's class. So in a matter of months he'd be making decisions that could turn over about half the roster. Id also bet a gazillion dollars kroft will transfer The dynamics of taking that red shirt season will make this so interesting. The guys who have taken their's already, Huggins, Thomas, Acree, and Coleman are "locked-in" to staying regardless of what happens. Their only real option is to stick in out, graduate after 4 years and move on as a graduate transfer; otherwise they only get to play 3 years instead of 4. The guys who haven't burned their red shirt year, Ishmael El-Amin, Bumbalough, Hendriks, and Kroft could all escape after this season without losing a year of eligibility. Hazen could also be okay if he's on schedule to graduate.
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Post by Lurkin McGurkin on Dec 4, 2019 8:12:42 GMT -6
We were a .500 team in Taylor's last two seasons. Whitford brought us back up from the cellar after he pushed us down there, kicked us around, then clumsily dragged us back up. And to think, I actually said hi to him at Starbucks once. Hang on a second. Just because he hasn't been doing his job well doesn't mean he should be shunned as a person. He's a good dude, just in over his head. We could use some more civility in this country.
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Post by universityjim on Dec 4, 2019 11:51:30 GMT -6
And to think, I actually said hi to him at Starbucks once. Hang on a second. Just because he hasn't been doing his job well doesn't mean he should be shunned as a person. He's a good dude, just in over his head. We could use some more civility in this country. I agree totally. You responded to my very sarcastic response to all the other posts. My post was supposed to be humorous, not serious.
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 4, 2019 12:34:58 GMT -6
Living in Muncie and being roughly the same age as the current fb and Bb staffs. I have gotten to now a lot of our current coaches. I coach their kids, I see them at school, some live in my neighborhood. My son and daughters are friends with their kids. Almost all of them both basketball and football are really nice people. When I happen to be around them I make it a point not to talk BSU sports because I do not think they should have to or want to talk about that in those settings. I might say good luck or great game but that's about it. I talk to them like I would talk to any other parent. Ive had less of these conversations with whit than the others but I swear to you trying to even have the smallest of talk with him is one of the most awkward conversations you will ever have. Do not get me wrong he is nice enough and never rude but he is just a weird dude. I do not know how he talks to a recruit maybe he is different in that setting but I just cant imagine it I hear you on this point. Some players might need something different on the recruiting trail to connect.
OTOH, his players do connect, and when they do connect seem to both respect and like him. Still some of this is the intangible "likable." It is not the first impression, that is certain. The recruits who sign seem to recognize he really cares and that is probably the secret to their connection.
Some of it is no doubt just that he is a bit of nerd. Hey, that is an not an awful thing in itself, but it means he has to work to engage in everyday social interaction. And. On the recruiting trail I can see that being something that can be overcome and not be such a burden, after all he has to be thinking about that as he meets people in his role as a recruiter, a enough different guy, and that guy may be quite different than what we see in ordinary interactions.
I do not at all see what some here refer to as "not caring" about it not caring about winning. He is intense and competitive. I can see maybe more the intensity of a PG under pressure, keeping his concentration, but being the chess player making right decisions is not being the fire breathing motivator we sometimes need. This is a team sport...it's not his intensity that is as important as it is he has to bring it out in others.
The valid criticism is he is not enough of an emotional leader as we would like.
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Post by williamtsherman on Dec 4, 2019 12:55:44 GMT -6
blah blah blah, no recruiting horsepower, blah blah blah
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Post by 00hmh on Dec 4, 2019 13:05:39 GMT -6
Hey, it's a discussion board. RMC was making a good point, not just complaining about results.
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Post by Lurkin McGurkin on Dec 4, 2019 15:33:18 GMT -6
Hang on a second. Just because he hasn't been doing his job well doesn't mean he should be shunned as a person. He's a good dude, just in over his head. We could use some more civility in this country. I agree totally. You responded to my very sarcastic response to all the other posts. My post was supposed to be humorous, not serious. We really need a sarcasm font.
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Post by CallingBS on Dec 4, 2019 17:15:27 GMT -6
Living in Muncie and being roughly the same age as the current fb and Bb staffs. I have gotten to now a lot of our current coaches. I coach their kids, I see them at school, some live in my neighborhood. My son and daughters are friends with their kids. Almost all of them both basketball and football are really nice people. When I happen to be around them I make it a point not to talk BSU sports because I do not think they should have to or want to talk about that in those settings. I might say good luck or great game but that's about it. I talk to them like I would talk to any other parent. Ive had less of these conversations with whit than the others but I swear to you trying to even have the smallest of talk with him is one of the most awkward conversations you will ever have. Do not get me wrong he is nice enough and never rude but he is just a weird dude. I do not know how he talks to a recruit maybe he is different in that setting but I just cant imagine it I hear you on this point. Some players might need something different on the recruiting trail to connect.
OTOH, his players do connect, and when they do connect seem to both respect and like him. Still some of this is the intangible "likable." It is not the first impression, that is certain. The recruits who sign seem to recognize he really cares and that is probably the secret to their connection.
Some of it is no doubt just that he is a bit of nerd. Hey, that is an not an awful thing in itself, but it means he has to work to engage in everyday social interaction. And. On the recruiting trail I can see that being something that can be overcome and not be such a burden, after all he has to be thinking about that as he meets people in his role as a recruiter, a enough different guy, and that guy may be quite different than what we see in ordinary interactions.
I do not at all see what some here refer to as "not caring" about it not caring about winning. He is intense and competitive. I can see maybe more the intensity of a PG under pressure, keeping his concentration, but being the chess player making right decisions is not being the fire breathing motivator we sometimes need. This is a team sport...it's not his intensity that is as important as it is he has to bring it out in others.
The valid criticism is he is not enough of an emotional leader as we would like.
Decent post IMHO, but A) he is not a good recruiter, and B) I think he is the classic case of someone not actually caring that much about the results. Some people are obsessed about results, which can be unhealthy, while others just love and adore the process and a predictable, consistent approach to life. I personally read through Whit's quotes as a guy who is in love with the process. That means he can be a contributor to results (winning), but he can't drive winning as a visionary leader. This is very basic performance psychology. We've seen this play out for what, 12 years between Taylor and Whitford. IMO, they are very similar coaches. They aren't charismatic leaders who can recruit high level kids and cast a clear vision for winning that assistants, players, and fans can get behind. It's role management and leadership 101, really. Bottom line, BSU basketball SHOULD be successful. As Sherm has pointed out plenty, despite mediocre pay and even budgets, the right coaches will leverage things BSU actually has that many others schools don't to be successful. You know, like those schools that beat us on a regular basis. Why do they beat us? Because they have program leadership that we've been lacking. Of course, as RF always says, a fish rots at the head, and this leadership problem starts with the head coach, but goes all the way to the top.
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Post by williamtsherman on Dec 4, 2019 17:19:05 GMT -6
We've seen this play out for what, 12 years between Taylor and Whitford. IMO, they are very similar coaches. Ain't that the truth. In fact, has anybody ever seen them together?
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