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Post by Bearkitten on Nov 27, 2022 21:32:20 GMT -6
The women’s and men’s volleyball programs have emerged as two of BSU’s most successful sports despite very mediocre support from the pep band, Code Red Dancers or cheerleaders. The BSU band has not appeared at a single women’s or men’s volleyball match the past two years! There is very little BSU student support for the women’s volleyball team, however the men’s volleyball team does get excellent student support. Code Red Dancers and cheerleaders only show up half the time for volleyball matches, yet they are out in full force at every women’s and men’s basketball game, even the pre season exhibition games against paltry NAIA opponents. Student attendance at women’s and men’s basketball games has been pathetic the past few years, although Coach Lewis is working hard to improve that on the men’s side. The women’s basketball team, despite doing well in the MAC West for many years, get basically no BSU student support! The Muncie community support is decent for all four sports. Not sure why both volleyball teams get the shaft from the band, Code Red Dancers and cheerleaders, but that needs to change! 3 consecutive NCAA appearances and the men’s volleyball team under 2022 National Coach of the Year Donan Cruz, have a great chance of making it 4 straight this season! Hopefully, BSU athletics will begin supporting their teams that are representing the university in the NCAA tournaments! I will almost guarantee there will be no BSU pep band, cheerleaders or Code Red Dancers supporting our Cardinals Thursday when BSU battles Marquette in the NCAA tournament. If we’re lucky Charlie Cardinal will be there! If this was women’s or men’s basketball, I guarantee they would all be there!
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Post by lmills72 on Nov 28, 2022 0:15:45 GMT -6
While I appreciate your sentiment and think it would be great if both programs had better support, I think you might be asking a lot of the students involved in those other groups.
I'm not sure about the cheerleaders or dancers, but I'm pretty sure none of the band members are on scholarship. Do we have scholarships for cheerleaders or dancers? Oh, there might be a few music majors in the band (officially called the "Cardinal Pride Basketball Band" - notice no volleyball mention there) and some of those might be on scholarship, but not to play in that band. And the "pep" band doesn't even organize and start rehearsal until late October, so it's not even a functioning group for most of the women's volleyball season.
I'm sure the students in all those groups sign some type of commitment agreement to show up at certain events, but (assuming no scholarships) imagine the voluntary time commitment they would be making if they had to show up at all the events you desire. I'm not sure about the pep band, cheerleaders or dancers, but kids in the marching band also have to pay certain fees to be part a part of it, so I wouldn't be surprised if there were fees attached to those other groups as well. So they're making commitments of time and money, and we want even more from them?
It would be great if there were no fees and all those kids were on scholarships, but where does that money come from? I guess if the football team had won one more game, they'd be sending the entire marching band to The Bahamas, so that money is probably floating around there somewhere, but I'm not sure where.
I'll also say this: I haven't been to a women's volleyball game in a few years, but was able to make it to a couple of men's games last year. The environment, even without a band, cheerleaders or dancers, was 10 times better than the environment for men's basketball games. But yeah, I'm sure the coaches and athletes would always appreciate more support.
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Post by Bearkitten on Nov 28, 2022 7:13:39 GMT -6
Not sure if you have ESPN+ and the Big 10 Network, where volleyball is on TV all week long, but if Miami, Ohio, Toledo, Northern Illinois, Bowling Green along with every Big 10 school provides the same support for volleyball as basketball, why can’t BSU? I can’t believe these schools provide scholarships for their volleyball pep bands, cheerleaders and dancers. Watching these matches on TV clearly shows how far Ball State is behind other MAC and Big 10 schools.
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Post by 00hmh on Nov 28, 2022 9:12:38 GMT -6
Not sure if you have ESPN+ and the Big 10 Network, where volleyball is on TV all week long, but if Miami, Ohio, Toledo, Northern Illinois, Bowling Green along with every Big 10 school provides the same support for volleyball as basketball, why can’t BSU? I can’t believe these schools provide scholarships for their volleyball pep bands, cheerleaders and dancers. Watching these matches on TV clearly shows how far Ball State is behind other MAC and Big 10 schools. The biggest difference is easy. Look at the relative size of athletic budgets in the B10, plus the donor base for fund raising for a championship team. We are not close to the B10 schools.
For the the MAC schools there is more modest advantage, but we are stretched in every department.
If it is only a comparison of home games in the MAC, I agree with you we might do more, at least to the extent these are volunteer student support activities. If there is financial support not so sure it's as easy as you think.
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Post by Bearkitten on Nov 28, 2022 11:45:02 GMT -6
While I appreciate your sentiment and think it would be great if both programs had better support, I think you might be asking a lot of the students involved in those other groups. I'm not sure about the cheerleaders or dancers, but I'm pretty sure none of the band members are on scholarship. Do we have scholarships for cheerleaders or dancers? Oh, there might be a few music majors in the band (officially called the "Cardinal Pride Basketball Band" - notice no volleyball mention there) and some of those might be on scholarship, but not to play in that band. And the "pep" band doesn't even organize and start rehearsal until late October, so it's not even a functioning group for most of the women's volleyball season. I'm sure the students in all those groups sign some type of commitment agreement to show up at certain events, but (assuming no scholarships) imagine the voluntary time commitment they would be making if they had to show up at all the events you desire. I'm not sure about the pep band, cheerleaders or dancers, but kids in the marching band also have to pay certain fees to be part a part of it, so I wouldn't be surprised if there were fees attached to those other groups as well. So they're making commitments of time and money, and we want even more from them? It would be great if there were no fees and all those kids were on scholarships, but where does that money come from? I guess if the football team had won one more game, they'd be sending the entire marching band to The Bahamas, so that money is probably floating around there somewhere, but I'm not sure where. I'll also say this: I haven't been to a women's volleyball game in a few years, but was able to make it to a couple of men's games last year. The environment, even without a band, cheerleaders or dancers, was 10 times better than the environment for men's basketball games. But yeah, I'm sure the coaches and athletes would always appreciate more support. Great point about the Bahamas Bowl band money that has to now be available. Can’t even imagine the cost to fly a 150 piece Pride of Mid American Band, spend two nights, food costs etc in contrast to busing a 25 piece pep band, 7 code red dancers and 8 cheerleaders to Milwaukee on Thursday and return Friday. Can anyone explain why this could not happen just as it would if the women’s basketball team were doing the same thing? BSU NCAA tournament appearances don’t grow on trees. Women’s basketball has made one appearance in history and men’s basketball has not gone to the Big Dance in 23 years. Let’s support both men’s and women’s volleyball and basketball when they make the NCAA tournament! |
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Post by 00hmh on Nov 28, 2022 12:41:59 GMT -6
While I appreciate your sentiment and think it would be great if both programs had better support, I think you might be asking a lot of the students involved in those other groups. I guess if the football team had won one more game, they'd be sending the entire marching band to The Bahamas, so that money is probably floating around there somewhere, but I'm not sure where. Great point about the Bahamas Bowl band money that has to now be available. First, I am not so sure about the Bahamas Bowl money ever floating around anywhere. Had we been in a bowl game there would have been some revenue and some proud donors who might have come forward. We'd have still suffered a net loss and funding that would have meant belt tightening including for WVB probably.
The best argument for sucking it up and dealing with the smaller loss involved in a pep band traveling along with the required but also much smaller outlay on all expenses for the VB tournament is that it's worth it.
Sure, not much if any additional ticket revenue or TV money or other tangible return, but that is dramatically true for the FB Bowls the last few years, too. The difference? FB has the clout because there are a lot more eyes on FB, more donors. That bowl appearance in a meaningless bowl even probably produces much more "goodwill" and intangible return than a VB tournament appearance.
There is an odd logic to continue with built in high losses for a FB program. The money IS there in a budget to fund most of the loss. The "extra money" can be raised by donors. VB on a shoestring budget not only has no fat, but relatively few people follow the sport and donor money is not enough to cover much "extra."
So the extra expense has to be kept to a minimum. But given that, why not find the travel money for a pep band, or dancers? It's not that great an expense. I do agree we should give it a try. It may work better than the men's travel to the West coast for the NCAA VB.
When the men went without any support to speak of, the major issue was that those students simply were not willing to take the time away from school and Break. It was a pretty bad time to try to do it.
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Post by 00hmh on Nov 28, 2022 16:48:43 GMT -6
It is a cheap trip to Milwaukee...
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Post by sdacardinal on Nov 29, 2022 11:13:18 GMT -6
Saw part of the Marquette/Creighton match and Marquette has three really powerful hitters but they still lost to Creighton. Marquette at 27-3 is also an at-large bid. BSU can play with anybody but this will be a tough match.
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Post by Bearkitten on Nov 29, 2022 15:26:47 GMT -6
Anyone know if the BSU Alumni association has planned a pre match rally for BSU Alumni and fans? I know there is always one before the MAC tournament in Cleveland. BSU has a lot of alumni in the Milwaukee area. Maybe former BSU AD Bill Scholl will even drop in. Scholl is the current AD at Marquette and did a fantastic job at BSU. There were a lot of BSU Alumni at UCLA last spring when BSU played #1 Hawaii in the men’s Final 4 that were terribly disappointed the BSU alumni association dropped the ball and had no pre match BSU get together before the Cardinals played the Rainbow Warriors in an incredible match that went 5 sets. Let’s hope the BSU alumni association doesn’t drop the volleyball again In Milwaukee!
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Post by sdacardinal on Nov 29, 2022 16:10:09 GMT -6
The Alumni Association has to know what a ball is before they can drop it. I will say they did a good job for the BSU-Army game at West Point in 2009 and earlier the International Bowl all for football. I may be wrong but I thought it was the Association that put these trips together.
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Post by Lurkin McGurkin on Nov 29, 2022 17:26:47 GMT -6
The Alumni Association has to know what a ball is before they can drop it. Speaking of dropping balls, did you see the USMNT goal by Pulisic against Iran? Should've been WEARING a "world cup", amiright? |
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Post by CallingBS on Nov 29, 2022 17:40:59 GMT -6
Volleyball, IMHO, is the most underrated spectator sport by far. Constant action. The men's game is pure power and athleticism. The women's game is athleticism, fundamentals and attention to detail, and strategy.
The women's matches used to have a great environment when Litchfield was at BSU.
The men's MIVA championship last year was flat out electric. So glad I drove up to Muncie for that one.
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Post by Bearkitten on Nov 29, 2022 19:25:41 GMT -6
Volleyball, IMHO, is the most underrated spectator sport by far. Constant action. The men's game is pure power and athleticism. The women's game is athleticism, fundamentals and attention to detail, and strategy. The women's matches used to have a great environment when Litchfield was at BSU. The men's MIVA championship last year was flat out electric. So glad I drove up to Muncie for that one. You would think the BSU Alumni Association would be chartering a bus for students and adults to Milwaukee and maybe they are and I am not aware of it. No question the late Ed Shipley would have been on top of all this. Not sure BSU has ever been the same since he passed away. And yes, the men’s championship a year ago was amazing. The BSU crowd rocked Worthen the entire match and the team really responded with a sweep and a trip to the Final 4 at UCLA. BSU was the only school in the Final 4 with no alumni association support, band, cheerleaders, mascot, and dancers. Hawaii even brought a team of baton twirlers and they were fun to watch! |
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Post by CallingBS on Nov 29, 2022 20:19:40 GMT -6
Volleyball, IMHO, is the most underrated spectator sport by far. Constant action. The men's game is pure power and athleticism. The women's game is athleticism, fundamentals and attention to detail, and strategy. The women's matches used to have a great environment when Litchfield was at BSU. The men's MIVA championship last year was flat out electric. So glad I drove up to Muncie for that one. You would think the BSU Alumni Association would be chartering a bus for students and adults to Milwaukee and maybe they are and I am not aware of it. No question the late Ed Shipley would have been on top of all this. Not sure BSU has ever been the same since he passed away. And yes, the men’s championship a year ago was amazing. The BSU crowd rocked Worthen the entire match and the team really responded with a sweep and a trip to the Final 4 at UCLA. BSU was the only school in the Final 4 with no alumni association support, band, cheerleaders, mascot, and dancers. Hawaii even brought a team of baton twirlers and they were fun to watch! BSU is a just a place now - devoid of heart, engagement, purpose, quality with a few exceptions |
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