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Post by 00hmh on Mar 19, 2022 8:26:37 GMT -6
As much as many on this board have espoused a more non-traditional approach to hiring the next coach, we seem to be easily distracted when names like Lewis, Johnson, Neal pop up....I think these guys, along with Darner, are appealing in part because they have some link to the area.... You can't trust anything their head coaches say; they're merely acting as their agents. Do they truly recognize that they probably just can't pick up the game they're coaching at UCLA or Purdue or Nevada and put it on the court in Worthen?...I'm just saying I have a lot of questions about all these guys.... just saying Goetz will surely be digging a lot deeper than anything our superficial conversation covers. Good points. And advantage to a big school guy or one with HC experience that an AD will always value is they know FAR more about the academic and administrative part of the job. And as discussed elsewhere all are far safer bets in terms of avoiding criticism, while a lower level guy can always be more easily questioned. Those assistants or those small time guys with shiny records at lower schools are hard to evaluate on many counts, and are better bets to be forgiven if they have some local connection, and that is a very dubious qualification when it comes down to it.
ADs who almost always have low tolerance for highly visible risk risk taking and not to be fair work for Presidents who don't have all that much flexibility should things not work out, are going to tend toward following conventional wisdom. UNLESS there is a real push by President to upgrade when they have license to take financial risk. How likely is that here?
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Post by rmcalhoun on Mar 19, 2022 8:32:32 GMT -6
The question is whether we want to compare to all mid majors or the top mid major conferences, and whether "not so bad" is good enough to attract top coaches in that marketplace. And of course whether not so bad results make us happy. Information we need also includes all other incentives, perks, and outside income opportunities which are relevant. And staff salaries and other support. Looking at total BB budget is sometimes deceptive, but helpful. Better than HC salary alone probably. We are not better and have not been in most other BB metrics than not so bad for a long time. I'm not sure how to project our future athletic budget. How will we compare to other MAC schools in next few years? Hard to see why we would be better? I personally don't care about being the top mid major program. I want us to be a top program in the mac. Play for and compete for Mac championships go to the tourney once every three or four years. We are in the shifty mac these are not lofty expectations |
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Post by 00hmh on Mar 19, 2022 8:39:22 GMT -6
The question is whether we want to compare to all mid majors or the top mid major conferences, and whether "not so bad" is good enough to attract top coaches in that marketplace. And of course whether not so bad results make us happy. I personally don't care about being the top mid major program. I want us to be a top program in the mac. Play for and compete for Mac championships go to the tourney once every three or four years. We are in the shifty mac these are not lofty expectations But wait a minute.
Take away the Big East where a few very high salary mid majors may live, take away the mid majors who really invest in success in BB as flagship like Gonzaga, and of the MANY other schools in other mid major conferences, now the MAC is one of the better conferences, and especially the MAC East.... Top 1/3? Better?
Just look at that list of mid majors and we are as you say "not so bad" as most. We are a one bid conference but with 4 or 5 schools able to win that bid, and often not the best of the 5 win it.
To do well in the MAC is not so easy. People denigrate it but need to look at the top 6 and bottom 1/2 separately. You don't push the envelope and the result is you become best of the rest, "not so bad"...just as BSU has done arguably. You need to push to compete with the best 4 or 5 Programs. |
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Post by sweep on Mar 19, 2022 8:53:44 GMT -6
I personally don't care about being the top mid major program. I want us to be a top program in the mac. Play for and compete for Mac championships go to the tourney once every three or four years. We are in the shifty mac these are not lofty expectations
Take away the Big East where a few very high salary mid majors may live................
Hey moron there are no Mid Majors in the BigEast............... |
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Post by 00hmh on Mar 19, 2022 10:21:12 GMT -6
Take away the Big East where a few very high salary mid majors may live................
Hey moron there are no Mid Majors in the BigEast............... Thought you considered Butler and others there were... |
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Post by rmcalhoun on Mar 19, 2022 11:13:26 GMT -6
I personally don't care about being the top mid major program. I want us to be a top program in the mac. Play for and compete for Mac championships go to the tourney once every three or four years. We are in the shifty mac these are not lofty expectations But wait a minute.
Take away the Big East where a few very high salary mid majors may live, take away the mid majors who really invest in success in BB as flagship like Gonzaga, and of the MANY other schools in other mid major conferences, now the MAC is one of the better conferences, and especially the MAC East.... Top 1/3? Better?
Just look at that list of mid majors and we are as you say "not so bad" as most. We are a one bid conference but with 4 or 5 schools able to win that bid, and often not the best of the 5 win it.
To do well in the MAC is not so easy. People denigrate it but need to look at the top 6 and bottom 1/2 separately. You don't push the envelope and the result is you become best of the rest, "not so bad"...just as BSU has done arguably. You need to push to compete with the best 4 or 5 Programs. It's not that difficult If we can not be as competitive as Akron Kent buffallo ohio.Then we might as well not even fucking play basketball. Those teams are not that good |
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Post by cardsbballfan on Mar 19, 2022 12:15:48 GMT -6
Hi all, new member here. I've enjoyed reading your thoughts on who might be our next coach. In thinking about who it might be and where that coach might come from, here's a thought... If wonder if our AD, with her UConn connections, might reach out to Kimani Young, a current UConn assistant under Head Coach Dan Hurley. Young has apparently made it known he wants to move up into the head coaching ranks, and he was rumored to be a possible choice for the current head coach opening at the University of Massachusetts. I wonder if our AD will reach out to him, given her UConn connections? Thoughts?
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Post by sweep on Mar 19, 2022 12:29:15 GMT -6
Looks like Dennis Gates is getting the Missouri job. We will see what he can do with Boogie...........
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Post by purplecats on Mar 19, 2022 13:33:36 GMT -6
Lots of moving parts here.
Anyone doubt that St Peters Coach is off to greener pastures? Travis Steele in play somewhere, like his stepbro Groce he might come back to the MAC or similar. Indiana Elite background so his recruiting is Midwest based and ties to Elite are a more natural fit.
Chris Mack is probably not happy that Sean Miller is being considered back at X but I doubt if Archie (who was just hired at RI), Chris, Cuonzo or similar would consider the MAC after Power conference stints. It was refreshing to see Jax St coach that was at Western Ky dropping down to take the reins and lead a team back to NCAA appearance.
This year post-COVID where many coaches were retained by ADs and overstayed to finally get gone this cycle is fascinating, There are many up and coming coaches that are looking for a chance to move up that were passed over, coaches that have been relieved of their positions that are looking, and presently employed guys at Morehead, Longwood, St Peter's and others that will probably be making a move. Not sure how Valentine taking over at Loyola has changed the attitudes of ADs toward younger assts heading up programs with no HC experience.
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Post by cardfan on Mar 19, 2022 13:37:44 GMT -6
But wait a minute.
Take away the Big East where a few very high salary mid majors may live, take away the mid majors who really invest in success in BB as flagship like Gonzaga, and of the MANY other schools in other mid major conferences, now the MAC is one of the better conferences, and especially the MAC East.... Top 1/3? Better?
Just look at that list of mid majors and we are as you say "not so bad" as most. We are a one bid conference but with 4 or 5 schools able to win that bid, and often not the best of the 5 win it.
To do well in the MAC is not so easy. People denigrate it but need to look at the top 6 and bottom 1/2 separately. You don't push the envelope and the result is you become best of the rest, "not so bad"...just as BSU has done arguably. You need to push to compete with the best 4 or 5 Programs. It's not that difficult If we can not be as competitive as Akron Kent buffallo ohio.Then we might as well not even fucking play basketball. Those teams are not that good Period. |
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Post by thebsukid on Mar 19, 2022 13:55:27 GMT -6
Yes, ethically they shouldn’t contact another Coach still in the tournament but like everyone is ethical or follows the rules??!!
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Post by rgmillikan on Mar 19, 2022 14:02:41 GMT -6
The BSU Job may appeal to Michael Lewis for another reason as his "back-up" plan & a TSIB "back-up plan". No one has a crystal ball on the success of running the BSU Program or TSIB having a sustained success with their program. We have had a head coach leave our program to later become a TSIB National Champion. We have had what was deemed an unsuccessful head coach fired to later become an TSIB assistant head coach. SUCCESS AT BSU - He has a great opportunity to stay or go to TSIB if they are unsuccessful and/or Woody retires with Dan Fife possibly not next in line at TSIB. Past history shows the BSU Head Coach position can lead to other possible coaching positions (i.e. we had a successful head coach go to Wisconsin, also). Our John E. Worthen Arena & "new" training facility makes the job more appealing to obtain success for whoever is picked by Beth Goetz. I am hoping for a successful coach that will stay for the long haul. Id rather lose a coach because a bigger program wants to pluck him away, a la Yoder, Majerus, McCollum than need to fire him because he doesn't get the job done. And hopefully the Whitford era is a lesson in not extending a coach 3 times over for not proving squat. I'd rather be a touch impatient than overly patient like multiple ADs were with Whitford. |
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Post by 00hmh on Mar 19, 2022 14:38:53 GMT -6
It's not that difficult If we can not be as competitive as Akron Kent buffallo ohio.Then we might as well not even fucking play basketball. Those teams are not that good Period. I agree we can do it. Should be the goal. But everyone has made more commitment to basketball success than we have. And those opposing coaches are pretty good, and probably starting the next season with better personnel and no learni ng curve as HC.
I dearly want us to hire a coach competitive with those schools. Expecting to beat them without more commitment to the program, without the same total budget and same staff salaries are handicaps with which we don't need to saddle a coach. Especially where we won't pay him like the best but expect him to perform like the best.
That looks to me like a commitment to be not so bad, and not quite as good as the top MAC teams. Big talk as we set high goals.
All hat and no cattle.
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Post by sweep on Mar 19, 2022 14:59:57 GMT -6
Should be the goal...............How does that jibe with you wanting to keep Whitford around forever ? |
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Post by rgmillikan on Mar 19, 2022 15:08:58 GMT -6
Should be the goal...............How does that jibe with you wanting to keep Whitford around forever ? 00 basically seems to believe us peasant fans should be satisfied with mediocrity until BSU is willing to spend more than any other MAC program on basketball. This is exactly why he was such a schill and constant apologist for Whitford, even defending him after thebsukid joined the rest of us who were dissatisfied with 3 of 4 MAC losing records to close his tenure |
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